Name: 2015 August - Lifeboat, Carolyn Baker interviews Stephen Jenkinson by Orphan Wisdom in Social-Spirituality
Duration: 58 min 18 s
Description: Stephen Jenkinson and Carolyn discuss grief, his new book Die Wise, and the deeper meaning of the word “catastrophe.” Stephen Jenkinson - 20150828 Lifeboat Interview With Carolyn Baker. Original podcast: http://prn.fm/lifeboat-hour-08-28-15/

Social-Spirituality

Dr. Sherwin Nuland died this week at the age of 83. He became well-known for his first book, How We Die, which won the National Book Award. For him, pondering death was a way of wondering at life — and the infinite variety of processes that maintain human life moment to moment. He reflects on the meaning of life by way of scrupulous and elegant detail about human physiology.

See more at www.onbeing.org/program/biology-spirit/184

About the image: Zoe Middleton poses behind an artwork entitled 'My Soul' by Katharine Dawson, which consists of a laser etched lead chrystal glass formation in the shape of a brain, and was created using the artists own MRI Scan, from an exhibit at the Wellcome Collection in London. Photo by Dan Kitwood/Getty Images.

Sherwin Nuland — The Biology of the Spirit (Mar 6, 2014)

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How did things get so f*cked up?


Like a true elder, Stephen hears my troubled plea and hangs with me as we traverse great swathes of time and geography, tracking the catholic project to convert the world to Christianity that began with Paul the Apostle, through to Columbus opening the door for colonization of the so-called New World by the Puritans, up to the modern era of residential schools, globalization, AI and the revival of Christian conservatism.

It's not an easy ride. Over the course of our conversation the range of emotions and responses is as broad as the story of How We Got Here. Grief, sorrow, bewilderment, joy and praise all make an appearance.

By the end, I'm mentally and emotionally spent and confess, "I can't take any more!" Stephen laughs and says, "I'm not sure I can take any more either." As Stephen says repeatedly, there are no answers, no way to fix things. But perhaps by wondering How We Got Here, we start to get a glimpse of How Things Could Be Otherwise and along the way, uncover a few hints on how to proceed like an ancestor worthy of being claimed.

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Embrace the wisdom of your years and let it shine brightly! Elderhood ain't the time to fade away - it's your time to illuminate the world with your experience and love.

As we journey through life, we often think about the legacy we want to leave behind. It's a big question that can bring up all sorts of emotions - from pride to anxiety. Today, we've got two incredible guests, Stephen Jenkinson and Kimberly Johnson, who are going to help shed some light on this question.

Together, we're going to explore their latest book, "Reckoning," and dive into topics like spirit work, elderhood, grief and plague, and building culture in a time where self-interest often comes first.

One thing that really stood out to us is the idea that elderhood is a function, not an identity. It's pretty mind-blowing stuff, and we can't wait to delve deeper into it.

So sit back, relax, and join us for an inspiring conversation with two amazing authors and thought leaders. Let's open our minds and broaden our horizons together!

May 2023, There’s no refund for real life. - Stephen Jenkinson and Kimberly Ann Johnson

Stephen Jenkinson's book Die Wise changed my life. I felt nervous at the beginning of this interview because I admire him a lot. For years, he led the palliative care department at a major Canadian hospital. Sitting at the deathbeds of more than 1,000 people, he discovered again and again “a wretched anxiety” around death. 

He understands this death phobia as a symptom of a larger cultural absence, including the loss of elders. In 2010 Stephen and his wife Nathalie opened the Orphan Wisdom School, a learning house for “elders-in-training”.

At 26 minutes tells me about a disturbing moment at an event he attended as a panellist that was intended to reconsider and revivify masculinity. Attendees demanded to know "who will superintend the elders?" and one said, "I bring infants into the world as a midwife and they are my elders." This story stuck with me. I think it captures how desperate the situation is: even among those interested enough in our collective wellbeing to pay to attend an event like that, we see this rejection of the notion of eldership because it feels too threatening, and a move instead to a kind of parent-child conflict or a "wisdom sweepstakes", as Stephen puts it.

I hope you enjoy our conversation. Stephen's repertoire as a culture worker and a master storyteller includes live music with veteran Canadian musician Gregory Hoskins. Their band tours England in 2023: 

August 8th - London, A Night of Grief & Mystery  

August 10th - Penzance, A Night of Grief & Mystery  

August 11 - Sanity & Soul: day long talk in Cornwall

Zac Fine, o50: Pathways to fulfilment in the second half of life

In this episode we discuss my recent experience with death; when my friend Erik died in an avalanche while we were skiing together. I use this time with Stephen in an attempt to be seen and heard, to learn, to share, to heal, to grieve. It was amazing and I hope you enjoy listening in on it. Thank you Stephen, for your time and inquiry and insight.

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The Conscious Perspective: Diving into the human condition with beings from all walks of life. Uncover a new perspective.

Stephen is a writer, public speaker, farmer and grief literacy advocate. He is the creator and principal instructor of the Orphan Wisdom School which serves as a teaching and learning house for the skills of deep living and making of human culture.

The Conscious Perspective #130 with Stephen Jenkinson

Activism, art, education, science, psychology, philosophy, health, spirituality… All these and more are featured in this lively, short (10-20 minute) companion to the diverse, award-winning one-hour New Dimensions program that has been broadcast on public radio since 1973.

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Background, transcript, and context: http://www.brainpickings.org/2015/01/02/sherwin-nuland-what-everybody-needs/

Excerpted from https://soundcloud.com/onbeing/sherwin-nuland-the-biology-of

MORE / TRANSCRIPT

Sherwin Nuland on what everybody needs

Stephen Jenkinson and Carolyn discuss grief, his new book Die Wise, and the deeper meaning of the word “catastrophe.” Stephen Jenkinson - 20150828 Lifeboat Interview With Carolyn Baker. Original podcast: http://prn.fm/lifeboat-hour-08-28-15/

2015 August - Lifeboat, Carolyn Baker interviews Stephen Jenkinson

Ken Rose interviews Stephen Jenkinson in a series of sessions about death and dying and Stephen's work at his Orphan Wisdom School. (http://orphanwisdom.com).

2015 August - Lifeboat, Carolyn Baker interviews Stephen Jenkinson

Orphan Wisdom

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