In this week’s episode rerun, host Daniel Raimi talks with Kim Stanley Robinson, acclaimed author of many books, most recently “The Ministry for the Future.” Robinson’s books vividly illustrate some of the most devastating potential consequences of climate change, but that’s not all they do—the books also offer innovation and optimism, imagining the ways in which we can prevent some of the worst impacts of climate change and adapt to the impacts that are unavoidable. Robinson discusses his recent visit to COP26 and his views on climate economics, modern monetary theory, space opera, and more.

We’re rebroadcasting this episode from the Resources Radio archive while the podcast team is on a break through the rest of December. We’ll be back with new episodes in the new year; in the meantime, enjoy this throwback and poke around the archive at Resources.org for more topics you might be interested in.

References and recommendations:

“The Ministry for the Future” by Kim Stanley Robinson; https://www.hachettebookgroup.com/titles/kim-stanley-robinson/the-ministry-for-the-future/9780316300162/

“The Price of Peace: Money, Democracy, and the Life of John Maynard Keynes” by Zachary D. Carter; https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/563378/the-price-of-peace-by-zachary-d-carter/

“Improving Discounting in the Social Cost of Carbon” by Brian Prest, William Pizer, and Richard Newell; https://www.resources.org/archives/improving-discounting-in-the-social-cost-of-carbon/

“Doughnut Economics: Seven Ways to Think Like a 21st-Century Economist” by Kate Raworth; https://www.chelseagreen.com/product/doughnut-economics-paperback/

The concept of “carbon currency” by Delton Chen; https://globalcarbonreward.org/carbon-currency/

“Hypothesis for a Risk Cost of Carbon: Revising the Externalities and Ethics of Climate Change” by Delton B. Chen, Joel van der Beek, and Jonathan Cloud; https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/978-3-030-03152-7_8

“Breaking Boundaries: The Science of Our Planet” by David Attenborough and Johan Rockström; https://www.netflix.com/title/81336476

Facing Fears and Imagining Innovation for Climate Change, with Kim Stanley Robinson (Rebroadcast)

In this week’s episode, host Margaret Walls talks with Megan Lawson, an economist and researcher at Headwaters Economics, about how outdoor recreation economies support communities throughout the United States despite creating unique challenges for their residents. Many US communities that border public lands and scenic natural areas have recreation-dependent economies, meaning a majority of the local economy is driven by recreational activities and tourism. Lawson explains how recreation-dependent economies can be vulnerable to over-tourism, shortages in affordable housing, and increased risk of wildfires and floods. Lawson then unpacks the feasibility of public land sales to address challenges in making affordable housing available and describes ways to increase hazard resilience in recreation-dependent communities to protect full-time residents and visitors. 

References and recommendations:

“Housing on public lands will be limited by wildfire risk and development challenges” by Megan Lawson; https://headwaterseconomics.org/public-lands/wildfire-public-land-housing/

“If/Then: The Slippery Slope of Federal Land Sales” by Margaret Walls and Alexandra Thompson; https://www.resources.org/common-resources/if-then-the-slippery-slope-of-federal-land-sales/

“In Defense of Public Lands” by Steven Davis; http://tupress.temple.edu/books/in-defense-of-public-lands

“History of the Rain” by Niall Williams; https://www.bloomsbury.com/us/history-of-the-rain-9781620407707/


Recreation-Dependent Communities, Public Lands, and Housing Affordability, with Megan Lawson

In this episode, Rob speaks with Elaine Buckberg, Senior Fellow at Harvard's Salata Institute for Climate and Sustainability, about the future of the EV market, both domestic and international. 

Read the transcript of this episode: https://www.belfercenter.org/sites/default/files/2025-07/elaine-buckberg-podcast-transcript-july-2025.pdf

The Future of EVs: A Conversation with Elaine Buckberg

In this week’s episode, host Kristin Hayes talks with Ben Hertz-Shargel, global head of a research team at Wood Mackenzie that investigates the connections between energy consumers and the electric grid, about how the increasing energy demand from artificial intelligence (AI) is reshaping electricity markets in the United States. In a recent report for Wood Mackenzie, Hertz-Shargel investigates large-load tariffs—a new utility rate plan for large customers, like data centers, whose exceptionally high electricity demand necessitates constructing additional infrastructure. Hertz-Shargel outlines ongoing uncertainty around whether the existing electricity market can accommodate data centers, along with potential avenues for data centers to promote clean energy development and protect individual energy consumers and households from undue electricity price increases.

References and recommendations:

“Large load tariffs: a looming challenge for utilities” by Ben Hertz-Shargel; https://www.woodmac.com/news/opinion/large-load-tariffs-a-looming-challenge-for-utilities/

“Large load tariffs have a problem. Clean transition tariffs are the solution.” by Ben Hertz-Shargel; https://www.utilitydive.com/news/large-load-clean-transition-tariffs-wood-mackenzie/749722/

“Extracting Profits from the Public: How Utility Ratepayers Are Paying for Big Tech’s Power” by Ari Peskoe and Eliza Martin; https://eelp.law.harvard.edu/extracting-profits-from-the-public-how-utility-ratepayers-are-paying-for-big-techs-power/

Large Loads: Who Bears the Costs of Meeting a Growing Demand for Electricity, with Ben Hertz-Shargel

In this week’s episode, host Kristin Hayes talks with Danny Richter, director of the Pricing Carbon Initiative, about the existing suite of carbon pricing policies, a set of climate policy tools designed to reduce carbon dioxide emissions by requiring companies and other entities to pay for each ton of carbon dioxide they release into the atmosphere. Richter evaluates the international and domestic approaches to carbon pricing policies, explaining their history, uptake, and longevity. Richter highlights the flexibility of carbon pricing programs—which allows policymakers to tailor the sources and investment of revenues from carbon pricing to their unique policy priorities—as key to the long-term success of these programs. Richter then outlines shifting attitudes toward carbon pricing in the United States, highlighting how successful cap-and-invest initiatives emphasize the economic advantages of these policies while delivering climate benefits.

References and recommendations:

Pricing Carbon Initiative; https://pricingcarbon.org/

“Fourth Generation Carbon Prices” by Danny Richter; https://pricingcarbon.org/2024/11/fourth-generation-carbon-prices/

“Reserved: Carbon Pricing and the Dollar’s Special Status” by Danny Richter; https://pricingcarbon.org/2025/04/reserved-carbon-pricing-and-the-dollars-special-status/

Carbon Pricing Dashboard from the World Bank; https://carbonpricingdashboard.worldbank.org/

“How Carbon Border Adjustments Might Drive Global Climate Policy Momentum” by Kimberly Clausing, Milan Elkerbout, Katarina Nehrkorn, and Catherine Wolfram; https://www.rff.org/publications/reports/how-carbon-border-adjustments-might-drive-global-climate-policy-momentum/

“Our Dollar, Your Problem” by Kenneth Rogoff; https://yalebooks.yale.edu/book/9780300275315/our-dollar-your-problem/

Carbon Pricing Is Dead. Long Live Carbon Pricing!, with Danny Richter

In this week’s episode, host Daniel Raimi talks with Diana Hernández, an associate professor and codirector of the Energy Opportunity Lab at the Center on Global Energy Policy at Columbia University, about the struggles that ordinary Americans face in accessing affordable and reliable energy. In her recently released book, Powerless: The People’s Struggle for Energy, Hernández documents how energy insecurity affects people across the country and analyzes policy solutions that can help address the challenge. Hernández explains the interconnections among housing, public health, and poverty through stories which highlight the highly personal nature of energy insecurity and the difficult choices many Americans must make between essential expenses. Hernández then outlines potential improvements to existing energy-assistance programs, including increased support for year-round energy expenses and program adaptations to accommodate a changing climate.

References and recommendations:

“Powerless: The People’s Struggle for Energy” by Diana Hernández and Jennifer Laird, https://www.russellsage.org/publications/powerless

“Abundance” by Ezra Klein and Derek Thompson; https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/Abundance/Ezra-Klein/9781668023488

“Plundered” by Bernadette Atuahene; https://bernadetteatuahene.com/plundered/

“Debí Tirar Más Fotos” album by Bad Bunny; https://www.allmusic.com/album/deb%C3%AD-tirar-m%C3%A1s-fotos-mw0004451357

Energy Affordability Is Personal, with Diana Hernandez

In this week’s episode, host Daniel Rami talks with Heather Zichal, global head of sustainability at JPMorganChase, about the role of financial institutions in the energy transition. Zichal explains how she has advanced climate policy goals from positions in the United States Congress, the executive branch, nonprofits, and the financial sector. From these diverse perspectives, Zichal outlines the opportunities and challenges for climate-policy stakeholders as they navigate an uncertain political environment. Zichal highlights how financial institutions support the energy transition through green finance commitments, supporting clients’ sustainability goals, and investing in emerging technologies to support the world’s energy needs. Zichal underscores the importance of promoting climate solutions that focus on long-term value in the context of commercial and sustainability goals and that balance environmental and business priorities.

References and recommendations:

“Ocean” with David Attenborough; https://silverbackfilms.tv/shows/oceanwithdavidattenborough/

Financing the Energy Transition amid Unpredictable Climate Policy, with Heather Zichal

In n this week’s episode, host Kristin Hayes talks with Kristen McCormack, Resources for the Future’s newest research fellow, about McCormack’s scholarly work on the impact of extreme temperatures on student absences, disciplinary infractions, and later-life outcomes. McCormack explains how she combined student data from a large urban school district in the United States, information about the presence or absence of air-conditioning, and environmental data to understand the causal link between temperature and student behavior. McCormack’s work reveals that hot temperatures lead to an increase in absences and disciplinary referrals and that school air-conditioning may be especially important in maintaining a safe learning environment for students as extreme temperatures become more common.

References and recommendations:

“Education Under Extremes: Temperature, Student Absenteeism, and Disciplinary Infractions” by Kristen McCormack; https://kristen-mccormack.com/files/mccormack_jmp.pdf

“The School to Prison Pipeline: Long-Run Impacts of School Suspensions on Adult Crime” by Andrew Bacher-Hicks, Stephen B. Billings, and David J. Deming; https://www.nber.org/papers/w26257

“How Much Hotter Is Your Hometown Than When You Were Born?” interactive infographic from the New York Times; https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/08/30/climate/how-much-hotter-is-your-hometown.html

“Meadowlark Sings and I Greet Him in Return,” a poem from the collection “Devotions” by Mary Oliver; https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/536247/devotions-a-read-with-jenna-pick-by-mary-oliver/

Sweating Over Student Behavior in Hot Schools, with Kristen McCormack

A rising star in the field of environmental economics, Anna Russo, a Junior Fellow with the Harvard Society of Fellows, shared her unique perspective on the collaborative environment at Harvard, her research methodology likened to solving puzzles, and the importance of combining diverse data sources to derive meaningful insights in the newest episode of “Environmental Insights: Discussions on Policy and Practice from the Harvard Environmental Economics Program.”

Read a transcript of the podcast: https://www.belfercenter.org/sites/default/files/2025-09/anna-russo-podcast-transcript-september-2025.pdf

Investigating Complex Market Design Questions: A Conversation with Anna Russo

In this week’s episode, host Margaret Walls talks with Dominic Parker, a professor at the University of Wisconsin–Madison, about the first US government–run environmental management agencies and how they’ve influenced the survival of wildlife in the United States. Parker’s new coauthored journal article discusses the economic, political, and social forces that led to the founding of state wildlife agencies and contributed to their growth over time. Parker explains how wildlife management agencies facilitated the rebound of several well-known species in the United States, including the white-tailed deer, after a period of intense decline. Parker underscores the importance of natural resource management that responds to the needs of both people and the environment, ensuring the continued enjoyment of natural spaces and survival of wildlife in the United States. 

References and recommendations:

“The Creation and Extent of America’s First Environmental Agencies” by Dean Lueck and Dominic Parker; https://www.journals.uchicago.edu/doi/abs/10.1086/734075

“Federal Funding and State Wildlife Conservation” by Dean Lueck and Dominic Parker; https://le.uwpress.org/content/98/3/461

“The Hunter’s Game: Poachers and Conservationists in Twentieth Century America” by Louis S. Warren; https://yalebooks.yale.edu/book/9780300080865/the-hunters-game/

“The Problem of Social Cost” by Ronald Coase; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Problem_of_Social_Cost

“Coyote America: A Natural and Supernatural History” by Dan Flores; https://www.hachettebookgroup.com/titles/dan-flores/coyote-america/9780465098538/

“The Age of Deer: Trouble and Kinship with Our Wild Neighbors” by Erika Howsare; https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/731239/the-age-of-deer-by-erika-howsare/

The Role of Government Agencies in Wildlife Abundance, Decimation, and Recovery, with Dominic Parker

In this week’s episode, host Daniel Raimi discusses fossil fuel subsidies with Paasha Mahdavi, an associate professor and cofounder of the 2035 Initiative at the University of California, Santa Barbara. They talk about how subsidies on goods such as gasoline and diesel lead to lower prices for consumers. However, because these subsidies encourage the use of fossil fuels, reforming such policies is important when promoting the use of renewable energy. Mahdavi explores why many attempts to reform fossil fuel subsidies have failed, and he proposes potential avenues for addressing the weaknesses of reforms which could lead to failure of the subsidies.

References and recommendations:

“Fossil fuel subsidy reforms have become more fragile” by Paasha Mahdavi, Michael L. Ross, and Evelyn Simoni; https://www.nature.com/articles/s41558-025-02283-4

“Why Do Governments Tax or Subsidize Fossil Fuels?” by Paasha Mahdavi, Cesar B. Martinez-Alvarez, and Michael L. Ross; https://www.journals.uchicago.edu/doi/abs/10.1086/719272

“Human Nature: Nine Ways to Feel About Our Changing Planet” by Kate Marvel; https://www.harpercollins.com/products/human-nature-kate-marvel

“Climate Change and National Security” TEDx talk by Josh Busby; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8neK0G0NJ8

Understanding Fossil Fuel Subsidies Around the World, with Paasha Mahdavi

Resources Radio is a weekly podcast by Resources for the Future. Each week we talk to leading experts about climate change, electricity, ecosystems, and more, making the latest research accessible to everyone.

Facing Fears and Imagining Innovation for Climate Change, with Kim Stanley Robinson (Rebroadcast)

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